The DrawingBoard

by **Peter Fries** » Sun May 25, 2003 10:31 am

I'm with Cameron-- I was bored last night and decided to see if going in to see the movie with low expectations would pleasantly surprise me. I ended up wasting eight bucks and almost three hours (!) last night to see a really bad movie in a nearly empty theater. It was actually even worse than I expected, though contrary to most geek opinion, I thought the special effects were fairly well done. Even though I was by myself, I couldn't help rolling my eyes in disgust several times during the movie. I was consumed by shame and self-loathing on the way home. I wish I'd stolen the movie off Kazaa instead so my ticket purchase wouldn't encourage WB.

by **THEARROW2000** » Sun May 25, 2003 12:21 pm

Well, when it comes right down to it, I have to agree with Cameron as well--the scene with the Architect was muddled as Hell--and that's NOT good moviemaking or good storytelling. It just wasn't clear and the gist of such a pivitol scene HAS TO BE CLEAR to sell the whole peril of the situation. I liked the movie for other reasons--the thunk, smash, boom popcorn thrills stuff. I know, that kind of dazzle does not a good movie make. At the time, I didn't want or feel a need to analyze the peice-because I knew at the outset it would shatter upon analysis. Cameron's breakdown of the Architect bit makes clear sense to me and I'm ashamed to admit I must be one of those "average" intellects to not have made sense of the ramble before now. A pity that the film needs that explaination to make sense. --Ken

by **Joe Early** » Sun May 25, 2003 12:49 pm

Why would the film fill you with shame and self-loathing? Sounds pretty dramatic to me. Stealing the movie from Kazaa isn't going to help stop the WB from making bad films but it sure will stop them from making good films.

by **Peter Fries** » Sun May 25, 2003 1:54 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Why would the film fill you with shame and self-loathing?<hr></blockquote> The film didn't fill me with anything; going to see it all alone on a Saturday night in an empty theater, even though I knew better made me feel stupid.

by **Ghost of Skimmy** » Mon May 26, 2003 4:19 am

"I'm not saying that the film has to "dumb it down," My friends, wife and I all got it perfectly the first time around - it's not an issue of clarity at all as the most relevant portions of the Neo/Architect conversation were plainly stated. People went to Reloaded to get a sensate rush and not to think. The problem is the same I've noticed since I was about 12 - people do not have the attention span to focus on anything that they have no choice BUT focus on. Those people should be happy that 2 Fast 2 Furious is coming out soon. "there's something to be said for clarity when you need maximum impact." I understand where you are coming from, but in this instance you are mixing 'succinct' with 'mediocrity'. IMO the worst sin that Hollywood commits is always playing to the masses - ie creating mediocrity. If art (and movies are art - not entertainment) is constantly re-designed to appeal the lowest common denominator, then that art ends up as a variety of bland decoration instead of a source of inspiration or a pathway to deeper thought. Deep thinking is not an American past-time unfortunately. One of the reasons I've taken to defending this movie is because it's waaaay better than people are giving it credit for - and worst of all - the criticisms are mere nitpicking. Had this movie been the first installment of the three, people would be blown away, and forgiving of the CGI in Neo vs. the Smiths, or the Zion dance scene, etc. This nitpicking is symptomatic of the "Criticism equals validation" culture Gen's X and Y have - that is to say - If you can nitpick the flaws in a poplular product of any sort, that lends credibility to your character. Which of course, is bullshit....Bullshit that is practiced far too often. This mode of thought is so bad and common, that it's to the point of dishonesty. I've heard people criticize it and then say "Maybe I will feel differently about it when I see it again tonight." WTF?!?!? Why are you seeing it again if it was "BAD"??! It would be great to get a list of all the favorite movies of people who nitpick Reloaded, because I guarantee in each of those people's lists you will find a few Independance Days, Armageddeons, Phantom Menace and AOTC's - ie crap movies that are celebrated due to SPFX or nostalgia, yet these people feel validated by criticizing perhaps the most anticipated sequel in movie history (yes, it's more anticipated than Star Wars.) It's funny that you bring up "Luke, I am your father." I don't know how old you guys are, but I went to the theater when this was first released and saw it a few times. IMO, Empire is clearly the best of the Star Wars flicks, but I remember the criticisms of it at the time: "Bad ending!" "All over the place!" "Luke is Darth Vader's father? WTF is up with that?" I even read a Reloaded review where the critic said "Reloaded fails making the same errors that Empire Strikes Back did." HA! MORON! <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/mad.gif ALT=">:"> <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/mad.gif ALT=">:"> Anyhow - Give this movie 3 - 5 years, go back and rewatch it within the context of the 1st and 3rd ones or within the context of your everyday sci-fi action flick, and I will bet that you (the critics) will apprectiate it after the onslaught of lame ass superhero and sci-fi flicks that Hollywood will be shoving down your throats mercilessly.

by **3r0therGr1mm** » Mon May 26, 2003 2:56 pm

HA. I'm with Skimmy. Well put. - Aron <a href="http://www.grimmdesign.com" target="top"><img src="http://www.grimmdesign.com/portfolio/picfolder/banner1.gif" style="border:0;"/></a>

by **HellboyOne** » Mon May 26, 2003 3:10 pm

Five gets you ten Cameron doesn't use the word "obfuscated" EVER outside "the matrix". Love ya, pal. <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START

--><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> R. <a href="http://www.rickcortes.com"><img src="http://www.rickcortes.com/sitemarker.jpg"/></a> <a href="http://www.sketchbooksessions.com"><img src="http://homepage.mac.com/artsyfartsy/.Pictures/ssbanner1.gif"/></a>

by **cartoonshane** » Mon May 26, 2003 3:15 pm

Saw it again today with my mom and daughter- enjoyed it even more.

by **allgoodnamesweretaken** » Mon May 26, 2003 3:15 pm

I agree Skimmy well put. I thought the scene with the creator was well done. He's a machine, the language fit the part. I thought it was well done. Really I wasnt that thrilled with the movie until that scene, it blew away all the notions from the first movie and made me like the series as a whole much better. I thought the whole "chosen one, propehcy, etc" stuff was tired and had been done a million times before, this scene blew that away and made the series much deeper to me personally. I thought the ending was great, I am looking forward to the next movie even more than the second one.

by **Peter Fries** » Mon May 26, 2003 3:25 pm

??? Are you seriously implying that the reason people don't like the movie is that it's too smart for them, or were you just trolling? Oh, yeah, boy that story was deeeep. It went right over my head. <img src="http://bbs.fuckedcompany.com/icons/tard.gif" style="border:0;"/>

by **CameronStewart** » Mon May 26, 2003 4:03 pm

This is one of those discussions (read: every single nerd discussion on the net) in which both camps have ceased to contribute anything new, relevant, or meaningful, and so it's just descended into the "if you like/don't like (x), then there must be something wrong with you." Rick, I actually DO use the word "obfuscate," and many others like it. It makes me feel BIG and CLEVER. <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START

--><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/intl/aenglish/images/emoticons/smile.gif ALT=":)"> -C <a href="http://www.cameron-stewart.com">www.cameron-stewart.com</a>

by **Ghost of Skimmy** » Tue May 27, 2003 2:23 am

"Are you seriously implying that the reason people don't like the movie is that it's too smart for them, or were you just trolling? Oh, yeah, boy that story was deeeep. It went right over my head." No I'm not trolling - SADLY. Your 80's style sarcasm implies that you think 75% of people in this country are not dumbasses. I disagree.

by **Peter Fries** » Tue May 27, 2003 5:21 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr>Your 80's style sarcasm<hr></blockquote> Wow, I've never been so skewered in my life by a zing. Maybe I had that coming. But still, that really hurt. You win! I hope you're happy, you big meanie. Tease the old man, why don't you...

by **trigger25** » Tue May 27, 2003 5:59 am

I thought it was a good film, not a great one. I just had too many problems with the pacing of the film to walk away feeling like I saw a great movie. It seems like the first half of the film could've have been tightened up and the second half expanded. I thought the last act had a lot of cool stuff going on (the coordinated assault on the skyscraper, the confrontation with the Architect, etc.), but it all felt a bit rushed. It seems like it (the choice, the aftermath) didn't quite have the impact it should have. Well, that's just my two cents anways. On a unrelated note, I am always amused how heated these movie threads get. I like reading them because I like getting everyone's opinion -- whether I agree with it or not. That's what the point of these kinds of threads seems to be -- people expressing their opinions. Instead it seems like they often turn into a fight about whose opinion is more "right". I say the more diverse and conflicting opinions posted the better. T.

by **Scott Thigpen** » Tue May 27, 2003 7:05 am

along with what trigger said... When I was a kid and went to a movie all you heard was either "oooh ahhh" by the crowd or "well that movie didn't do much for me but hey, it was nice to get out of the house with the family" now everyone is a little movie director and you goto the movies and here this "oh my god! did you see that track lighting? the hue of blue they had on her face totally didn't match the computer backdrop" or "What!? That CGI was totally rendered in 72dpi instead of the original 300dpi! I bet they were using Maya instead of 3ds!" I say: what the hell!? It's a movie! but since we're on the matrix thread, allow me to geek out for a moment and propose a detour on this thread: Question: How long before a matrix is truely realised? And/Or how long until Sentinent Robots are as intuitive and creative as a human and controls the human instead of visa/versa? Possible flame issues: What happens to Religion? What happens to our need to exsist? How will we live? How will happiness be defined for us? Scott <a href="http://www.sthig.com" target="_new"><img border=0 src="http://www.sthig.com/web%20design/graphics/loRES%20main%20graphics/sthig.link.jpg" /></a> <a href="http://www.sthig.com/" target="_new">Scott Thigpen -- Illustrator </a> <table width="136" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="136" align="center" valign="middle"><div align="left"><a href="http://www.sthig.com/100things.cfm" target="_new">100 Things about me</a> </div> <div align="left"></div></td> </tr> <tr> <td height="30" align="center" valign="bottom"><div align="left"><a href="http://www.mizdos.com/100things.htm" target="_new">The 100 Things WebRing</a></div></td> </tr></table><a href="http://www.sthig.com/" target="_new"> </a>

The DrawingBoard

What is the Matrix reloaded? ( spoilers galore )

ugh

Re: What is the Matrix reloaded? ( spoilers galore )

ugh!

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ha!

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80s style sarcasm?!?

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Re: ha!

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